(no subject)

[graculus]

A quote from someone over on Our Stargate forum:

"A show that lasts 8 years at some point outlasts its source material."

Is it me, or is that an incredibly sad statement to be making about any show? Particularly one so rich in potential (most of it unrealised, particularly in recent years) as Stargate SG-1?

Maybe I'm just being maudlin, but that kind of statement doesn't take into account the deliberate dismantling and discarding of said source material, the shoehorning in of other elements that make it just like every other show in place of the things that made SG distinct and special. The things that got so many of us to make the jump from the movie to the tv show and keep on watching, cheesy as some of season 1 was.

But apparently the people who came into the fandom from the movie over-estimate the importance of Jack and Daniel, we neglect Sam and Teal'c because of it. The unspoken implication is this makes us selfish.That we should have embraced the (for many of us, much less interesting) new characters and consider them equal to the original.

Well, I'd say I like Teal'c way better than I like Jack nowadays (and lets not even get into the whole Carter thing), but I don't think that was what they meant...

Comments

Source Material being outlasted

[gategrrl.livejournal.com]

The main response I can think of to that comment (and I haven't posted it on OS yet) is that, if the source material has outlasted the show, then how is it there is so much fanfic out there that taps into it? How can there still be so much fascinating stuff/adventures on the net, outside the purview of the producer/writers, that use elements of the show in such creative ways?

I think the only thing that's outlasted its creativity on this production are the people who write it.

Re: Source Material being outlasted

[graculus.livejournal.com]

Couldn't agree with you more.

The one thing the show has outlasted clearly is the writer's desire to use the source material by quite a way, though occasionally it gets tapped into (when they can't find a reason to have the characters running down corridors or to blow stuff up).

[nausica2.livejournal.com]

Totally ditto on the liking Teal'c more than Jack nowadays. And on the other stuff too.

I've read the transcript for the lowdown thing, and having Damian Kindler saying "Oh, I think Baal is an egyptian god" it's the epithome of how bad they have ruined it and how they didn't get what SG was about.

Sg-1 seasons 1 to 3 was a clever way of expanding the movie, the new characters were interesting enough and the plots were faithful to the spirit but also exploring new possibilities. I love Sam seasons 1 to 3. Teal'c could do better but then from time to time you have him saying stuff like the one he says in Serpent's song and it's brilliant.

It went to hell after Glassner left. Brad Wright can write good scripts, but he is lacking in the continiuity and being creative department. In season 4 they took the easy road and look what we have now.

Another problem is that the kind of people you're referring to, are people who came to the show in season 4. Many of the ponyclub members are typical ship material, people who ship the people in JAG just as they ship Sam and Jack, so they don't care for the original SG stuff the same way as us.

You've been here for a very long time, and you and me can count lots of people we knew that aren't around or haven't been for ages, because the show shifted. We've stayed and we've met new people but we've become an anacronism in this fandom.

Which is very appropiate, as we like our Dear Daniel so much. ;-)

[graculus.livejournal.com]

I've read the transcript for the lowdown thing, and having Damian Kindler saying "Oh, I think Baal is an egyptian god" it's the epithome of how bad they have ruined it and how they didn't get what SG was about.

No, that's just plain ignorance - I couldn't imagine embarrassing myself in public that way by opening my mouth and having such crap come out of it as these guys do. Do they have no pride in what they're doing?

[xochiquetzl]

It's not just you--that's sad.

As for being selfish, how dare I like the parts of the show I like instead of the parts some other person likes? The noive!

Also: Teal'c rules.

[graculus.livejournal.com]

Teal'c does rule. Unfortunately, for all the spouting about Teal'c being important too, that doesn't seem to be borne out by ongoing behaviour...

[sg1jb]

Actually, I did not view that to be a valid statement about the show (or, any show in particular); I see it as a statement about the mindset of the person who said it.

I disagree with it with regards to this show in particular, and disagree with it as being applicable to 'any' show that manages to last however long. The nature and strength of the underlying foundation of this show, and its ongoing potential -- and/or any other particular show -- is something which imo isn't dependent upon someone's timeline, but rather is a function of it's coherency and inherent potential.

To realise potential (to even be aware of it and its scope in the first place) requires insight and imagination and the ability to expand upon existing concepts... if this show has departed from its roots and the underlying foundation has been undermined, imo it sure as hell is not because there's some sort of time-dependent lifespan line drawn by someone's unimaginative mind.

Imo the person who made the statement used it as a form of justification, or defense, for a point of view that dismisses ones she doesn't agree with. She can certainly do that, and she can certianly believe and opine whatever she likes, however (irrespective of my opinion on why the statement was made) imo the statement presents a fallacious, unsound, and illegitimate concept, especailly in the case of this show. Imo.

So There!

[graculus.livejournal.com]

Actually, I did not view that to be a valid statement about the show (or, any show in particular); I see it as a statement about the mindset of the person who said it.

Well, there's that as well... ;)

To realise potential (to even be aware of it and its scope in the first place) requires insight and imagination and the ability to expand upon existing concepts... if this show has departed from its roots and the underlying foundation has been undermined, imo it sure as hell is not because there's some sort of time-dependent lifespan line drawn by someone's unimaginative mind.

Couldn't have said it better myself. It's such a waste, so much so that it becomes even more frustrating when people try and 'explain' it by specious theories like this.

[thenightsfall]

In the case of Stargate, rather than a matter of outliving the original source material, I think it's a matter of disavowing it even exists, including Seasons 1-3, when certain yahoos took over in Season 4. (All due apologies to Yahoo! for taking their name in vain.) Worst thing that ever happened to this show, that change in personnel.

Rant

[katyabaturinsky.livejournal.com]

"A show that lasts 8 years at some point outlasts its source material."

Um -- not really, as TPTB of this show don't appear to have paid any attention to their own source material in years. Such potential, wasted by a bunch of aging frat boys who would rather lift crap elements from X-Files (yeah, let's have some more conspiracy theory...::snore::) and other shows instead of using the amazingly dense backstory of this one.

And I may be a newbie, but I'm not a moron. Therefore, I resent being force-fed a diet of Sam-'n-Jack when there is all the sexual chemistry of concrete between those two characters. Not to mention how deeply, deeply offensive I find it that this is the only thing they could think of to do with what was once one of the better female characters on TV; no way in hell would anyone who is as smart, ambitious, and tough as Sam is supposed to be act in such a junior-high-school manner, no matter how she is supposed to feel about her CO. (She would immediately sacrifice all of the respect she has fought so hard to earn from all the male AF personnel and be viewed by most of them as nothing more than the Colonel's piece of tail.) It's not that I don't like Sam -- I used to like Sam quite a lot. But I don't like the Bimbo Barbie who has taken Sam's place.

Teal'c, however, continues to kick almighty ass. There should only be more of him. Lots more.

It has gotten so bad that my immediate reaction to the finale of last season was, "Oh, thank god he's frozen. Let's leave him that way, and maybe we'll be able to drop all that shipper crap and get some decent stories while Jack's a popsicle." Which is perhaps not the reaction that the ep was supposed to elicit, eh?

Re: Rant

[graculus.livejournal.com]

And I may be a newbie, but I'm not a moron. Therefore, I resent being force-fed a diet of Sam-'n-Jack when there is all the sexual chemistry of concrete between those two characters.

Ah but apparently those of us who followed through to the series from the movie are the only people who think that something else is important. Brainwashing or some thing. Besides, we're in denial of what was Always Meant To Be. Or some such.

If it was reciprocal it might be a *little* more realistic, though I have to say, AT's acting range, not that impressive imo - meanwhile RDA just looks constipated.

Teal'c, however, continues to kick almighty ass. There should only be more of him. Lots more.

You know, if someone sent me their new snail mail address, someone might get a nice surprise in the post... ;) Not *quite* as nice as last time, but still nice.

It has gotten so bad that my immediate reaction to the finale of last season was, "Oh, thank god he's frozen. Let's leave him that way, and maybe we'll be able to drop all that shipper crap and get some decent stories while Jack's a popsicle."

http://cartoons.ashtonpress.net/sglollipop.jpg

And it gave them the chance to show how much more Sammiepoos cares for Jack than those callous team members of hers. Pffft. Did you feel the Jack/Teal'c love, though? ;)